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	<title>Comments on: &quot;Land First, Then Peace&quot;: letter by former Saudi Ambassador to the USA and UK</title>
	<atom:link href="http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/</link>
	<description>Free Minds for a Free Palestine</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 20:09:51 +0300</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Jason</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-13740</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Dec 2009 02:29:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-13740</guid>
		<description>If Israel goes down Mecca and Medice will be the two first cities to go. It in Saudi Arabia best interest to protect these two cities to have a embassy in Israel in Jerusalem it self and close government building as possible. Please do not have me into how embassies are used for spying. Both USA and USSR used their embassies for gather intelligence during Cold War. Because Arab states did not have embassy in Israel capitol city the human race just avoid got whip out</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If Israel goes down Mecca and Medice will be the two first cities to go. It in Saudi Arabia best interest to protect these two cities to have a embassy in Israel in Jerusalem it self and close government building as possible. Please do not have me into how embassies are used for spying. Both USA and USSR used their embassies for gather intelligence during Cold War. Because Arab states did not have embassy in Israel capitol city the human race just avoid got whip out</p>
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		<title>By: TheAZCowBoy, Tombstone, AZ.</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-11731</link>
		<dc:creator>TheAZCowBoy, Tombstone, AZ.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Sep 2009 05:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-11731</guid>
		<description>In the end decency triumphs over evil - and the genocidal Jews know that G-d knows for it is written in the Holy Scriptures.....

                                                                                 Psalm 145:20
                         
                                   &#039;Jehovah is guarding them that love him - the evil ones he will annihilate,&#039;

AmeriKKKa has showed the world in their murderous behavior exhibited in Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos - In Panama, Guatemala, Honduras (and honduras again recently) El Salvador - in Chile, Haiti, Grenada and more recently in Iraq, Afghanistan and now Somalia where the Great Satan has massacred more than a million innocents (86% of them women and children) with a little help from their Jewish hemmoroids - that it is unworthy as a world leader</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the end decency triumphs over evil &#8211; and the genocidal Jews know that G-d knows for it is written in the Holy Scriptures&#8230;..</p>
<p>                                                                                 Psalm 145:20</p>
<p>                                   &#039;Jehovah is guarding them that love him &#8211; the evil ones he will annihilate,&#039;</p>
<p>AmeriKKKa has showed the world in their murderous behavior exhibited in Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos &#8211; In Panama, Guatemala, Honduras (and honduras again recently) El Salvador &#8211; in Chile, Haiti, Grenada and more recently in Iraq, Afghanistan and now Somalia where the Great Satan has massacred more than a million innocents (86% of them women and children) with a little help from their Jewish hemmoroids &#8211; that it is unworthy as a world leader</p>
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		<title>By: Izabella</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-11665</link>
		<dc:creator>Izabella</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 12:52:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-11665</guid>
		<description>I will never recognize israel regardless if Saudi Arabia does or not. Saudi Arabias leaders are not chosen by the ummah to act as the leaders of Muslims, nor is their regime legitimate in Islam. 

Those that want to give israel recognition in return of arab lands are ignoring that israel itself is arab land, it is Palestine. If ur willing to sell away 80 percent of Palestine then you might as well sell away the remaining 20 percent... why pretend to have principles when it comes to 20 % of Palestine only? walaw lesh hal ghalabeh. The arab peace initiative doesnt even give all of the refugees a right to return to Palestine, instead it says &quot;a just solution for the refugees&quot; which very easily can be translated in to allowing back a few and then settling others in their host countries which will suit Saudia Arabia just fine as it will increase the number of sunnis in Lebanon. Palestinians are only a tool used in the political game between these arab leaders, none of the actually care about the rights of Palestinians, it doesnt matter if king this is better than king that or if king this is better than Arafat, what diffirence does it make when they are all corrupt and have chosen to take the enemy as allies and are backing each other in corruption? 

Those that have given up on Palestine in its real form might as well give up on it in this fictional mini-form regardless if it is a Palestinian leader, a saudi prince or any other arab that sees no wrong in giving up 80 percent of Palestine. What kind of state is this mini palestine that they want to create...  a state where you have to cross another &quot;country&quot; to get to the other side of your country (when going from the WB to Gaza you will have to travel thrue &quot;israel&quot; and consider it a seperate country when u know this is ur country just as much as the WB is), is this a state? It is a joke.

The PLO-fatah is, was and will remain garbage, that i know but that will not make me settle for &quot;whatever we can get&quot;. Never. Dont forget that Saudi Arabia is backing the corrupt Abbas regime both politicly and financially just like after Oslo, they were backing Arafat who got a large chunk of his money from Saudi Arabia as a reward so as far as i am concerned, they are all allies in trying to destroy the Palestinian cause by making Palestinians settle for whatever under the illusion of gaining a victory while these leaders remain safe in their positions. They are all on the same side. Saudi Arabia has trilions of dollars invested in the US which supports israel as if she is her mother and give away the Islamic oil to people that are against the arab/Islamic ummah so I dont agree that Saudi Arabia is comitted to full withdrawal as they are sitting on all that oil yet no Muslim country is really benefiting from it in a real way, especially not the Palestinians. Simply use ur oil to get the withdrawal if ur really comitted, that is logic.

Just imagine what that oil wealth could have done to the Islamic world if used properly, instead it is used to benefit those that wage war on Muslims and protect israel (with that saudi wealth) while the &quot;benefit&quot; Muslims get from it is more corrupt arab tv. These leaders have made a joke of the arabs, when they get sick they go to the West seeking the best treatment instead of making sure that best treatment exist in the arab world, they could have made it happen with their money instead they give away the money to benefit those that protect their position so they can remain as kings, princes and presidents.

Just recently the UAE donated 150 million dollars to a children center in the already wealthy USA, if they really cared about children why dont they also donate that amount to children centers in poor Muslim countries, why not give that money to al shifa hospital in Gaza? All these rich arab leaders care about is pleasing their masters, in return they get to cling on to their positions.

I can not stand hearing anyone praise these arab leaders (Saudi, Emirati, Jordanian, Egyptian, Palestinian, Lebanese, Lybian, Syrian, Omani etc etc) in any form as they are all part of the same evil force even if they from time to time bicker with each other based on their small greedy pride-and-worship-seeking arrogant minds, they are all still on the same side even when they disagree, i dont care who is worse than the other as they are all bad and partners in crime one way or the other.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I will never recognize israel regardless if Saudi Arabia does or not. Saudi Arabias leaders are not chosen by the ummah to act as the leaders of Muslims, nor is their regime legitimate in Islam. </p>
<p>Those that want to give israel recognition in return of arab lands are ignoring that israel itself is arab land, it is Palestine. If ur willing to sell away 80 percent of Palestine then you might as well sell away the remaining 20 percent&#8230; why pretend to have principles when it comes to 20 % of Palestine only? walaw lesh hal ghalabeh. The arab peace initiative doesnt even give all of the refugees a right to return to Palestine, instead it says &#034;a just solution for the refugees&#034; which very easily can be translated in to allowing back a few and then settling others in their host countries which will suit Saudia Arabia just fine as it will increase the number of sunnis in Lebanon. Palestinians are only a tool used in the political game between these arab leaders, none of the actually care about the rights of Palestinians, it doesnt matter if king this is better than king that or if king this is better than Arafat, what diffirence does it make when they are all corrupt and have chosen to take the enemy as allies and are backing each other in corruption? </p>
<p>Those that have given up on Palestine in its real form might as well give up on it in this fictional mini-form regardless if it is a Palestinian leader, a saudi prince or any other arab that sees no wrong in giving up 80 percent of Palestine. What kind of state is this mini palestine that they want to create&#8230;  a state where you have to cross another &#034;country&#034; to get to the other side of your country (when going from the WB to Gaza you will have to travel thrue &#034;israel&#034; and consider it a seperate country when u know this is ur country just as much as the WB is), is this a state? It is a joke.</p>
<p>The PLO-fatah is, was and will remain garbage, that i know but that will not make me settle for &#034;whatever we can get&#034;. Never. Dont forget that Saudi Arabia is backing the corrupt Abbas regime both politicly and financially just like after Oslo, they were backing Arafat who got a large chunk of his money from Saudi Arabia as a reward so as far as i am concerned, they are all allies in trying to destroy the Palestinian cause by making Palestinians settle for whatever under the illusion of gaining a victory while these leaders remain safe in their positions. They are all on the same side. Saudi Arabia has trilions of dollars invested in the US which supports israel as if she is her mother and give away the Islamic oil to people that are against the arab/Islamic ummah so I dont agree that Saudi Arabia is comitted to full withdrawal as they are sitting on all that oil yet no Muslim country is really benefiting from it in a real way, especially not the Palestinians. Simply use ur oil to get the withdrawal if ur really comitted, that is logic.</p>
<p>Just imagine what that oil wealth could have done to the Islamic world if used properly, instead it is used to benefit those that wage war on Muslims and protect israel (with that saudi wealth) while the &#034;benefit&#034; Muslims get from it is more corrupt arab tv. These leaders have made a joke of the arabs, when they get sick they go to the West seeking the best treatment instead of making sure that best treatment exist in the arab world, they could have made it happen with their money instead they give away the money to benefit those that protect their position so they can remain as kings, princes and presidents.</p>
<p>Just recently the UAE donated 150 million dollars to a children center in the already wealthy USA, if they really cared about children why dont they also donate that amount to children centers in poor Muslim countries, why not give that money to al shifa hospital in Gaza? All these rich arab leaders care about is pleasing their masters, in return they get to cling on to their positions.</p>
<p>I can not stand hearing anyone praise these arab leaders (Saudi, Emirati, Jordanian, Egyptian, Palestinian, Lebanese, Lybian, Syrian, Omani etc etc) in any form as they are all part of the same evil force even if they from time to time bicker with each other based on their small greedy pride-and-worship-seeking arrogant minds, they are all still on the same side even when they disagree, i dont care who is worse than the other as they are all bad and partners in crime one way or the other.</p>
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		<title>By: sami jamil jadallah</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-11660</link>
		<dc:creator>sami jamil jadallah</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Sep 2009 09:48:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-11660</guid>
		<description>When the not so smart, reckless, incompetent corrupt failed Palestinian Trio of Arafat, Abbas and Qurai negotiated Oslo they simply failed to see that the main issue and conflict with Israel is the land, the land of 1948, the land of 67, and that once Israel takes over the land it is almost impossible to force it out. Of course people are important, but then it is so easy to “transfer” people and force them off the land by force or other means. When President Jimmy Carter offered Arafat the 67 land in exchange for recognition of Israel, Arafat simply ignored the letter which was personally delivered in Jeddah by Cyrus Vance through the late King Fahad. The letter was handed over to Arafat aid Khalid Al-Hassan who delivered to Arafat with the promise he will come back within few days with a positive answer. Arafat answer came in the form of firey speech delivered in Damascus where he declared the PLO mission is liberation of Palestine from “water to water”. At that time there were less than 4,000 settlers and Israel did not take all of the surrounding areas of Jerusalem, Ramallah, Hebron and Nablus. In Oslo the stupid leadership instead of seeking the return of the land, they gave full recognition to Israel with its elastic and expanding borders, with East Jerusalem and of course with settlements that has eaten what is left of Palestine of 67. And what did this criminal leadership sought? They sought Israel’s recognition of the PLO and the “sole representative of the Palestinian people, (TOZ and Alf TOZ). Not only that but this fraudulent leadership agreed to give Israel total control of major chunks of Palestinian areas to expand its settlement, to take over water resources and of course to build the Apartheid Wall, which Israel had the plan for it a long time. The only benefit of Oslo is that one gained by the leadership with a chance to raid and fleeces the treasury shifting billions into their private accounts and private businesses, as is the tens of billions they stole and wasted all these years (remained unaccounted for) was not enough. Ah of course in exchange for allowing Arafat to have his Royal Guard and his red carpet, Israel demanded Arafat organize a security force to augment the Israeli army to provide protection and security for the Israeli army, and armed Jewish settlers. Arafat the corrupt and criminal dictator he was went further and organized two preventive security forces (like Shin Bet and Savak) and appointed two ruthless commanders that terrorized the people making sure that Arafat &amp; Company are secure in their new duties as managers of the Israeli Occupation. With all of this the Palestinian people go out and spend $5 million to build a memorial for Arafat rather than digging his grave and throwing his bones in the sea. And yes, we fail to wonder what is wrong with us? After 15 years of formal and official recognition of Israel by the PLO, Israel continues to refer to the “occupied areas” as Judea and Samaria. I wonder if Saeb Euraikat ever challenges this in meetings with his friends the Israeli partners. Saudi Arabia is the only Arab country to remain committed to full withdrawal for full recognition and Prince Turki is right, Land first, then Peace. I wonder if the Ramallah leadership under stand and appreciate this statement and act accordingly. I doubt it. Perhaps it is best for the Arabs certainly the Palestinians to have someone like Prince Turki Al-Faisal to be the Palestinian and Arab to lead any discussions and negotiations with Israel. The Palestinian leadership that failed at liberation and gave us Oslo is simply unfit and unqualified to represent the interests of those under Occupation, let alone the millions in the Diaspora.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>When the not so smart, reckless, incompetent corrupt failed Palestinian Trio of Arafat, Abbas and Qurai negotiated Oslo they simply failed to see that the main issue and conflict with Israel is the land, the land of 1948, the land of 67, and that once Israel takes over the land it is almost impossible to force it out. Of course people are important, but then it is so easy to “transfer” people and force them off the land by force or other means. When President Jimmy Carter offered Arafat the 67 land in exchange for recognition of Israel, Arafat simply ignored the letter which was personally delivered in Jeddah by Cyrus Vance through the late King Fahad. The letter was handed over to Arafat aid Khalid Al-Hassan who delivered to Arafat with the promise he will come back within few days with a positive answer. Arafat answer came in the form of firey speech delivered in Damascus where he declared the PLO mission is liberation of Palestine from “water to water”. At that time there were less than 4,000 settlers and Israel did not take all of the surrounding areas of Jerusalem, Ramallah, Hebron and Nablus. In Oslo the stupid leadership instead of seeking the return of the land, they gave full recognition to Israel with its elastic and expanding borders, with East Jerusalem and of course with settlements that has eaten what is left of Palestine of 67. And what did this criminal leadership sought? They sought Israel’s recognition of the PLO and the “sole representative of the Palestinian people, (TOZ and Alf TOZ). Not only that but this fraudulent leadership agreed to give Israel total control of major chunks of Palestinian areas to expand its settlement, to take over water resources and of course to build the Apartheid Wall, which Israel had the plan for it a long time. The only benefit of Oslo is that one gained by the leadership with a chance to raid and fleeces the treasury shifting billions into their private accounts and private businesses, as is the tens of billions they stole and wasted all these years (remained unaccounted for) was not enough. Ah of course in exchange for allowing Arafat to have his Royal Guard and his red carpet, Israel demanded Arafat organize a security force to augment the Israeli army to provide protection and security for the Israeli army, and armed Jewish settlers. Arafat the corrupt and criminal dictator he was went further and organized two preventive security forces (like Shin Bet and Savak) and appointed two ruthless commanders that terrorized the people making sure that Arafat &amp; Company are secure in their new duties as managers of the Israeli Occupation. With all of this the Palestinian people go out and spend $5 million to build a memorial for Arafat rather than digging his grave and throwing his bones in the sea. And yes, we fail to wonder what is wrong with us? After 15 years of formal and official recognition of Israel by the PLO, Israel continues to refer to the “occupied areas” as Judea and Samaria. I wonder if Saeb Euraikat ever challenges this in meetings with his friends the Israeli partners. Saudi Arabia is the only Arab country to remain committed to full withdrawal for full recognition and Prince Turki is right, Land first, then Peace. I wonder if the Ramallah leadership under stand and appreciate this statement and act accordingly. I doubt it. Perhaps it is best for the Arabs certainly the Palestinians to have someone like Prince Turki Al-Faisal to be the Palestinian and Arab to lead any discussions and negotiations with Israel. The Palestinian leadership that failed at liberation and gave us Oslo is simply unfit and unqualified to represent the interests of those under Occupation, let alone the millions in the Diaspora.</p>
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		<title>By: ginosz</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-11658</link>
		<dc:creator>ginosz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Sep 2009 23:39:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-11658</guid>
		<description>we thank ourselves that the zionist-jews and their co-horts are too arrogant and blind to the level of being plain stupid to see that this offer would make palestinians agree to only 22% of palestine. 

but no, they must reject it. as do their supporters. so in the end, we still have a war to finish. and israel as a zionist-jewish entity is just bidding time before it becomes another topic in the pages of history books. 

suffer we shall. and victory we shall attain. and no obama nor UN in the way..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>we thank ourselves that the zionist-jews and their co-horts are too arrogant and blind to the level of being plain stupid to see that this offer would make palestinians agree to only 22% of palestine. </p>
<p>but no, they must reject it. as do their supporters. so in the end, we still have a war to finish. and israel as a zionist-jewish entity is just bidding time before it becomes another topic in the pages of history books. </p>
<p>suffer we shall. and victory we shall attain. and no obama nor UN in the way..</p>
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		<title>By: bozh</title>
		<link>http://palestinethinktank.com/2009/09/16/land-first-then-peace-letter-by-former-saudi-ambassador-to-the-usa-and-uk/#comment-11654</link>
		<dc:creator>bozh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Sep 2009 17:09:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://palestinethinktank.com/?p=4443#comment-11654</guid>
		<description>calling for destruction of israel by hamas was a wrong thing to do;  in spite of the fact that israel had already destroyed expalestine.
Thus a wish does not equate the actuality and especially in view that fighting israel wld mean taking on US.

&quot;Land for peace&quot;  label may have been invented just like the name &quot;jew&quot; and their connection to judea had been, by &#039;jews&#039;; i.e., an multiethnicity with worst cult imaginable
It appears  as a distort of reality as the land that pal&#039;ns own [wb+gaza] is morally and legally their land.

One wld have to be total idiot to negotiate one&#039;s house or homeland with a stranger; and murderous at that!

The label  &quot;refugee&quot; apears also a distort of reality. The label  &quot;expelees&quot; fits reality. Many people have been threatened with death, some actually executed in cold blood; thus, the word &quot;expulsion&quot; is much better; even tho some left for safety; which was their right!

When one takes refuge s&#039;mwhere, it cld be because of flood, hail, storms, etc. In addition when one finds refuge s&#039;where it cld elicit the notion that such person is basically OK because people in her/his new environ are looking after them and everytihng is OK;  at least, to some minds!
Use of such label in meanings appears like the label refugees of the  katrina fame. New orleans people were not expelled nor were  pal&#039;ns expelled.
UN shdl be ashamed of self for perping this fraud. tnx</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>calling for destruction of israel by hamas was a wrong thing to do;  in spite of the fact that israel had already destroyed expalestine.<br />
Thus a wish does not equate the actuality and especially in view that fighting israel wld mean taking on US.</p>
<p>&#034;Land for peace&#034;  label may have been invented just like the name &#034;jew&#034; and their connection to judea had been, by &#039;jews&#039;; i.e., an multiethnicity with worst cult imaginable<br />
It appears  as a distort of reality as the land that pal&#039;ns own [wb+gaza] is morally and legally their land.</p>
<p>One wld have to be total idiot to negotiate one&#039;s house or homeland with a stranger; and murderous at that!</p>
<p>The label  &#034;refugee&#034; apears also a distort of reality. The label  &#034;expelees&#034; fits reality. Many people have been threatened with death, some actually executed in cold blood; thus, the word &#034;expulsion&#034; is much better; even tho some left for safety; which was their right!</p>
<p>When one takes refuge s&#039;mwhere, it cld be because of flood, hail, storms, etc. In addition when one finds refuge s&#039;where it cld elicit the notion that such person is basically OK because people in her/his new environ are looking after them and everytihng is OK;  at least, to some minds!<br />
Use of such label in meanings appears like the label refugees of the  katrina fame. New orleans people were not expelled nor were  pal&#039;ns expelled.<br />
UN shdl be ashamed of self for perping this fraud. tnx</p>
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